MUSIC INTERVIEW: PENDULUM

A Multi-National, Multi-Genre, Multi-Headed Beast Looks To Conquer America

 

The Australian-British band, Pendulum, is a musical hybrid on many levels. Its roots were in a Perth-based rock band called Xygen, but exposure to electronic music in the early 2000s led Rob Swire and Gareth McGrillen to break up Xygen, relocate to the UK, and begin afresh as Pendulum. Three albums later, they have become one of the biggest live electronic acts in the world, blending elements of punk, rock, house and electronica in ways that are quite unique. Fresh off a run playing with Linkin Park across America, founding member Gareth and British additional Ben Mount sat down with Buzzine in the Hollywood Hills before their sold-out LA show at The Wiltern Theatre.

 

Stefan Goldby: The beginnings of this group was in an Australian rock band. How did that evolve into the multi-national multi-genre multi-headed beast that is Pendulum?

 

Gareth McGrillen: The beginnings my relationship with Rob [Swire] is from rock music and punk and stuff like that, when we started out in high school…we always had a passion for electronic music, but it was something that was more on the side.  I think when dance music was at its biggest in the UK, probably when you [Rob] were at university and stuff like that; in Australia, it was really un-cool to be into dance music…if you didn’t listen to Nirvana and Pearl Jam, you got beat up.  So it was like we were closet dance music fans.  We couldn’t really express it in public. But then I guess dance music just became a little bit more popular. Drum & Bass came along in 1999, and we really got into it then and started producing it and put all the rock stuff aside. We broke up that band and moved to the UK when we made our first track. But I guess, as was made obvious later, the roots that we had started, in rock and punk and stuff like that, eventually seeped into the music later in the picture.

 

SG: And you’ve played with those different musical elements throughout - maybe the first record (Hold Your Colour) was the most staunchly dance, the second (In Silico) maybe more staunchly rock, and then with this third album, the “pendulum” (sorry) is now more in the middle.  Is Immersion the best balance of all those elements so far?  

 

GM: That’s exactly what Immersion is.  Immersion is literally our favorite parts of album one and album two taken to a new extreme. We couldn’t have done a heavy metal track on In Silico, and I don’t know if, at the time we thought about it, but if we wanted to do a house track on Hold Your Colour, we would have, but back then we just couldn’t do it…we didn’t have the creative license to really go in all directions. So with Immersion, we have the audience and the audience size to do it. Also I think we scared our audience so much that they were really expecting anything, so we could put a house track on there, we could put a heavy metal track on there, we could do collabs with all sorts of people…so Immersion is all the bits we liked from the first two, done right. 

 

SG: Thinking back to the making of Immersion, is there a moment that stands out more than the rest?

 

GM: In a way, it lacked bad moments because, unlike In Silico, where Rob and I nearly both had nervous breakdowns and the album took too long to do, and we kind of chased our tails for too long…but on Immersion, it was like…

 

Ben Mount: You were making music that was working on the dance floor with DJs as well, so the tracks were getting tried out.  Everything just fell into place. As Rob and Gareth would come with a new track, we’d try it out on the road. It would go off, they’d change certain bits—bang! Next one… It flowed.

 

GM: I wouldn’t say the album wrote itself, but it nearly did.  It was really a pleasure to do, rather than a lot of pain and a lot of crying and cutting yourself at night… [Laughs] But a standout moment was getting to work with In Flames.  Having almost jokingly putting them at the top of a collaborations list, not expecting them to want to do it with us, and then going from that to literally, days later, having them all standing in our studio.  Those are big guys. These are actual Vikings, I think, or descendants of Vikings. [Laughs] So having them all in our studio and just laying down some tracks was quite incredible.

 

SG: Your history is mixing things together, and even bringing new people into that mix…If Pendulum started as a mix of Gareth and Rob,  you have a history of continually expanding on that mix, both through adding more members, like Ben and new collaborators, like In Flames – on Immersion, what specifically did bringing them, bringing Liam Howlett (The Prodigy), bringing other people into the circle do to change your mindset for this record?

 

GM: The idea behind bringing collaborations in on this album was they all had their different purposes. The In Flames one was almost like a middle finger to dance music having rules. We always want to do things that we know would really piss people off, to an extent. There are certain remixes that we haven’t done specifically out of respect for certain people, but a part of us always wants to do things like that, so making a heavy metal track… We even did a cover of Coldplay live on radio, but it was literally death metal.  Things like that…

 

BM: Then there was this talk of the “Us Vs The Prodigy--is there a beef?” And I think the Liam Howlett collaboration crushed all that.  People always compare us to them, I guess because the guys did a really big remix of “Voodoo People” for them, so that was another thing that had to be squashed.  And Porcupine Tree was another collaboration…

 

GM: That was something that happened really last-minute, because of time and stuff like that, and Rob is a really big fan of Porcupine Tree.  I hadn’t actually heard a lot of them, but Steve Wilson I’m a huge fan of. I didn’t realize, because I love Opeth and stuff, and he produced and engineered them.  And because he’s a producer/engineer, and we only had 24 hours to get this collaboration done, he literally turned it around in 24 hours. It was incredible. 

 

But the whole Prodigy thing, we gigged with them a lot, but we never really got to hang out, and in Australia we forged a bit of a relationship…we were hanging out, because the Big Day Out tour in Australia is basically a big day off, so there’s lots of partying and stuff like that, so we were hanging out with them and it was a case of , “Do you hate us?” And we were like, “No. [Laughs] Do you hate us?” “No. Let’s do a tune…” [Laughs]  Because there was a big media-generated…it’s a big British thing… media-generated animosity that doesn’t really exist, and we wanted to put it to bed.

 

SG: How important is it to Pendulum as a band that you all go off and exist as DJs away from the band?

 

BM: I think that’s how it’s always been, and I think that many bands try to do that in reverse…they become a band and they’re like, “Oh, we can DJ as well.”  But we came through as DJs and then formed a band, so…

 

GM: We were even polling in the DJ Top 100 back when that’s what we were as a band, so we’ve always been thoroughly entrenched in that world, and now it’s a vehicle for us to literally have our audience A&R the album with us. 

 

BM: Perfect testing ground there.  If they go off, it’s good.  If they don’t go off: back to the drawing board. And it’s better than some A&R person going, “I think this might work…” You can see instantly.

 

SG: Traditionally, the weakest part of dance music was live performance and yet that’s clearly one of the strengths for you guys as a band.  Was that always the intention? 

 

GM: We grew up, obviously, liking dance music but never really being able to be able to be into it, so seeing it live wasn’t even in the cards.  We were too young to go to clubs and see DJ’ing and stuff like that, but then a band called The Prodigy came along, and they did this aggressive, punk rock version of dance music, and they were live. And from that, you grow up and hear about other live bands and stuff like that, so at back of our heads, it was there that it was possible to do it live. I think a lot of bands from that era struggled with performing it 100% live because the technology didn’t exist.

 

Coming from the DJ world, we were able to DJ in a fashion like DJs from that scene, like Andy C, and create such an enormous amount of energy just from DJing, the way you blend tracks together, that it was almost essential to portray the music that way - with that much energy. So we’re then stuck in a situation where okay, the technology doesn’t exist, and we would have to perform it in a way that was like a DJ set, where you just literally turn an audience into a mosh-pit.  So how is that even going to be done? And then just our luck, the technology literally arrived sort of at the doorstep the minute we decided that… Everyone was telling us, after Hold Your Colour, that this sounds like a band. Even though we were like, “What? What are you talking about? Shhh!” 

 

BM: It was trying to emulate the studio sound live and there was nothing that could do it, so they found these computers called Receptors [The Muse Research Receptor Unit], and they basically mean you can run your synth in the studio in a live format, and the drums and everything can run, so you don’t just have your acoustic snare; you have your acoustic snare plus the sample put on top, but it’s all being triggered live, and this is something Prodigy, this is something the Chemical Brothers, this is something Basement Jaxx…nobody ever did, and they had to crack the software to make it work originally. So they were rigging up the people, saying, “Can we do this on your machine?” They’re like, “No,” but they guys were going, “But actually you can.” So trying to get technical support…[laughs]

 

GM: And they’re a great bunch, but bless them, they’d just started out as a company as well, so they were just kind of pioneering it…

 

BM: And they were like, “How many do you have on stage?” And we were like, “14,” And they were like, “But…” [Laughs] They were expecting to run one or two units, and they were running like everything, processing…

 

GM: So I think, technically, as far as computers crunching numbers is concerned, it was the most high-powered computer set-up on stage in history, second to Ricky Martin and U2…

 

BM: So of course all the money that had been generated from DJ’ing and all this stuff all went into the equipment. It was make or break. It was like, if this doesn’t work, then there’s no other chance. And thank God we had an incredible run at festivals, like Glastonbury, Reading…huge European festivals…and then that opened the market up: the TV market, the BBC market…and then that’s what basically just took it off…

 

GM: I think the massive risk back then was “Yes, we’re doing this live, and we’re all playing it live, but is anyone gonna actually care”?  Because whether it sounds good or not, if you’ve got a massive audience in front of you that love your tracks and stuff like that, and it’s coming off a tape, I don’t think anyone is really gonna notice and really gonna care, so we weren’t even sure if it was going to be worth our time and money and effort and tears and sanity to put it all together, but I think somehow, I don’t know how we did it, but somehow, by having real musicians playing it live, we somehow stepped the energy level up to 11, and that just rocketed us up through the…roof.

 

SG: In some ways, you did that part back to front. You’re almost the first band to break through just by playing big shows, as opposed to building up to big shows. How do you scale that back? You’re playing the Wiltern here in LA tonight--that’s no festival stage, for example. How have you reverse-engineered the club show from the festival show?

 

GM: With club shows, for us, there’s a certain minimum size, and from that, it doesn’t matter - we’ll play small. As long as we can fit all the equipment on and…because there’s a certain level of production that’s needed for us to just even perform the stuff, so we can’t do a hotel lobby…

 

BM: We can’t really do an acoustic session.  [Laughs]

 

GM: I think the smallest we can do is like 1,000 capacity venues, as long as the stage is the right size. There’s five of us onstage and we bang into each other a lot as well, on top of having so much equipment.

 

BM: I think we shine in a small, intense environment and to 90,000 people - it’s great like that.  If it’s small, it’s intense and sweaty, and everyone is getting elbowed in the face and it’s moshpits, but then if it’s at a festival, it’s just one big huge riot, so we’re lucky in that respect.  It translates well in every kind of situation.

 

SG: As a band that’s gained a lot of fans through the live show, do you have something that you hope they walk away, from seeing you guys for the first time, thinking?

 

BM: Just “What the hell was that? I feel better now. I got it out of my system.”  It’s a real release. It’s escapism.

 

GM: Especially coming from, I think, the British audiences.  Obviously, in America, you got the credit crunch and you have loans and things like that, and people have always got something that they get a bit down about…but especially in Britain where it’s grey and the food is shit.  So if, for an hour a week or something like that, they can get out and go see a Drum & Bass night or go and see Pendulum live, I think it just really takes you away from anything you were worried about.   British people are notorious for escapism; that’s why they’ve got pub culture, which is great, and that’s why they’re sort of obsessed with celebrities and obsessed with tabloids and stuff.  So in a country like that, we really thrived because our music just took you out of this world.

 

SG: I’ve heard it said a few times--and it never seems right to me, but whatever—that America is kind of like a cultural hybrid of Britain and Australia in some ways.

 

GM: I’d agree with that. I think Australia is kind of a small America, and there are underlying themes of Britishness everything throughout the world.

 

SG: How have you found it, bringing you music to America?

 

GM: America is a tough place, but we definitely think we’ve got something that American audiences want, because we see the reactions in small pockets. We just finished supporting Linkin Park, so we did about 18 shows with them across the eastern seaboard and a bit in the middle, where we were playing to 15,000 pairs of ears a night. And for us, being such spoiled brats when it comes to crowd reactions, at first we were just like, “No one is giving a shit.”

 

BM: The agent is like, “Okay, guys, 1% of these people know you.”  [Laughs] So we walk out there…

 

GM: And people are eating hot dogs and they’ve got popcorn, just waiting for Chester (Bennington) and Mike (Shinoda) to come on stage.  But then every night, 2,000 people or whatever would go away being like, “What the hell was that?” So in a sea of 15,000 people, it’s hard to not let your ego just absolutely die inside you.

 

BM: It was early every night, but at the end of every gig, you could see that the whole place was applauding and the whole place got it, and it was a real challenge for us because we’ve never really had to do that. It went whoosh so quickly, so everywhere we go it’s, “Pen-Du-Lum!” before we got on stage, so we were there and it was literally silence - people eating, so we really got some.  And then we got to New York and we sold out with the Irving Plaza, and went to Canada and did a side show in Toronto…

 

GM: I think the Linkin Park tour was really good for us because it was a challenge, and we needed to sort of challenge ourselves again, because we were starting to get a bit relaxed.   For us, it’s not like we don’t appreciate our crowd; we appreciate every single gig and come off stage feeling buzzed, but for us, we’re getting to a point where unless it was great, we just didn’t feel amazing…even though we had an audience of 20,000 that destroyed themselves…unless it was just the best gig, it wasn’t good enough. And then we did the Linkin Park tour and then went back to doing our tour with our own audience, and it made us really appreciate it.

 

BM: I think we became tighter as a band.  When you’re up against it and the situation is reversed, you knit together, and we could have gone whoosh in opposite directions or we could get tighter, and luckily it all came together.  It’s perfectly set us up now…we’re going straight to Australia from here and then back into UK festivals…

 

GM: And we’re coming back to Miami to do the Ultra Festival as well…

 

BM: So it’s been really good for us because January and February, traditionally bands don’t really tour, there’s not an awful lot going on, so for us to come out here and play every night, I think, has been a really positive experience, definitely.

 

SG: The other way of getting your music out is via music videos, and “Salt In The Wounds” is a little bit of a special music video, to put it mildly.  Can you talk a little bit about where the idea for a 360 degree interactive video came from?

 

GM: The “Salt in the Wounds” video was inspired by…the people that film Google Maps and map all the different streets and towns around the world have a certain technology that films in 360 degrees, and we saw a video of them surveying the damage in Haiti after the earthquakes, and we thought it was such an incredible way to portray a video - to literally give someone 360 degrees to explore as the video moves along.  And then it just turned into a viral idea, where we could film a video and give people clues in the video where they can find the links to a download and give away “Salt in the Wounds”…we just launched the campaign and it gives people something really interesting to see there…

 

BM: The production, the music, and the ideas…we try to make it futuristic and next-level and something from another planet…and I think if we push the multi-media aspect of all our ideas in that same direction with the technology, it’s all forward-thinking and futuristic thinking, and that’s the idea.  Give the kids something to think about, rather than just the band or five guys going, “Yeah, we’re cool.”  Why not give them something to actually really get involved in and interact with?  We’re always looking for things like that to push everything forward.

 

SG: Leaning on the cutting edge is great, and going digital and doing all these things… But after losing an entire track’s worth of digital recordings last year,  how likely is it that you’ll buy another Macbook?

 

GM: I’d buy anything that Steve Jobs releases. 

 

BM: We’ve got three laptops this tour, between us.  [Laughs]

 

SG: So that was an isolated instance that hasn’t undermined your faith in Mac?

 

GM: Rob, bless him, has had the worst luck with Macs.  And he’s still on one.  He just bought another one…

 

BM: All his Macs are PCs, though, they’re all running Windows.

 

GM: I run Windows sometimes, but now I’ve just completely… [Laughs] He’s just had bad luck.

 

BM: His last machine heated up and melted.

 

GM: And then the one before that, the CD-Rom died after dropping it.

 

BM: But he does push it to where I don’t think he’s supposed to push it. [Laughs]

 

GM: Gets them to sing and dance, basically.

 

BM: Gareth modifies V8s and Rob modifies Macs. [Laughs]

 

SG: Immersion has been out a while, at this point.  And knowing where you guys work, I’m sure the next thing is already somewhat underway, if at least in your heads. Can you just let us know where you’re at and what to expect in terms of new music?

 

GM: At the moment, writing…and you can ask any band, I think…writing on the road just doesn’t really work, but one thing we can achieve, and what we did achieve last time with writing, is pre-production. We did a lot of ideas on the road on our European and our US tour back before Immersion, but then we got back to England and just threw them away.  But what it does is it’s like a sports athlete going into training in pre-season.  Pre-production for us is like working the production muscle up to a level where it flows and it’s really quick…

 

BM: So rather than completing an entire track, making some synth patches or some drum breaks that would be relevant…it’s like an artist collecting colors for the palette to then paint the picture…making sure you’ve got the exact right color to go and then make the image. That’s basically it.

 

SG: Do you have any sense of what the timing is and where you guys are at?

 

GM: No, not really.

 

BM: I think we need a break. We’ve been four years, with our manager saying “Get in the studio! Get on the stage!” I think we’re gonna take six months, but then we’ll do six months of DJ’ing, so it won’t be a break, but it will be a break from being on the tour bus with seven crew and…

 

GM: I think, with this next record, there’s a lot of talk going around which, to be fair, is our fault. There’s a lot of talk going around that it’s going to be a punk record, and I think we need to stipulate what that actually means.  What we meant by that was not influenced by The Sex Pistols and The Ramones.  It’s gonna be a Pendulum record that, in the production sense, is going to be approached with a punk ethos, so it’s going to be raw and aggressive.  It’s still going to be a Pendulum record.   That’s one thing we like about us—within eight bars of a tune playing, people know it’s us or not...

 

BM: It’s kind of like a heavyweight bout with gloves…just a fist fight, a cage fight.  [Laughs] That would be the way.  With barbed wire and cats scratching.  [Laughs]

 

GM: Throw a snake into the ring…

 

BM: A couple of sharks, you know, out of the water, flopping around.  [Laughs]

 

Pendulum's latest album 'Immersion' is out now on Atlantic Records.